Too Hot to Handle

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Is the debate getting too hot to handle? I thought it was cruising along nicely with the odd ludicrous assertion – Ian Murray’s Stickergate – and overblown nonsense you expect in a prolonged, passionate national discussion, until I read Bill Jamieson in the Scotsman. He thinks it’s turning so sour that after the vote we may have our own ‘Caledonian Krisallnacht’.

Achtung, baby! Why is it the very people who demand everybody calms down and gets reasonable are the same ones who leap to Nazi Germany for their metaphors? When Brian Wilson (also in the Scotsman) attacked me – for criticising BBC presenters – he alluded to Stormtroopers. Now I deliberately interpreted that as a Star Wars reference to save his embarrassment but I have little doubt he intended it to mean…yes, our Nazi friends again. (The last uniform I wore was the Boy Scouts, First Selkirk, Cheetah Platoon).

You see in the mind of the professional commentator used to handing down tablets of sagacity on stone to the nation, there is no room left on Mount Olympus, so we must dismiss the voice of the people, those poor souls who haven’t been adorned with official approval.  They’re not playing the game, not using the approved language. They’re usurping Her Majesty’s Imperial Press – and they don’t like it.

Yesterday I wrote about… “the pious who nevertheless find space in their condemnation for the odd dismissive barb themselves.” I didn’t expect to be justified so soon.

To be fair to Bill, he is a fine Scot, an outstanding journalist and good bloke and he knows his market – Scotland’s business types who play such an important role in our country. But ‘fractious and ugly’, ‘anger and menace’? A Truth and Reconciliation Commission?  ‘The biggest schism since the Reformation’? Really? It’s funny because the world I inhabit has never seemed so optimistic, inspired, communal and positive. There is creativity of a kind we’ve never experienced before, there is wit and satire, the bursting of pomposity balloons, a people-led assertion of rights, a shared sense of purpose, the generation of the most democratic, non-party grassroots movement from Yell to Yetholm and a grand national debate which has engulfed everybody from our school children to corporate bosses. What’s not to like? Where is this irrational fury?

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Could it be that Bill, like others in the conventional media, doesn’t quite live in the same space? In other words, he talks to finance directors, investors and money-movers whose orbit is limited to investment risk and margin and who wouldn’t understand what ordinary people are talking about. This is the famed and self-styled Business Community who, like their big brothers in the City, imagine the world to revolve around them, mainly because down there it does. The government allows job seekers to work for companies literally for nothing but goes to war against Brussels to defend bankers bonuses.

Business is crucial to a functioning western democracy and I am passionate supporter of economic activity and believe, for example, that a totally new process for business start-ups should be introduced to eliminate the myriad restrictions of law and administration and initial cost that deter ordinary people with drive from opening their own business. Our system is predicated far too much on opening the world of business to those with the right education and qualifications rather than to everyman irrespective of social badge, accent or training and demands too much in observance of employment law, accountancy, bureaucracy and office costs. These barriers should be lowered to make initial entry easier and the full weight of legal liabilities and taxes introduced retrospectively – AFTER a company succeeds and is sustainable. We must take risk to earn success. (Time to take my anti-Tory tablets).

But there is a sense of entitlement about our friends in suits that I find objectionable, especially in the hallowed halls of finance. People who make a living from moving other peoples money around are hardly the bedrock of society and heaven knows, we’ve seen the catastrophe they wreaked on us all over the six or seven years. Undaunted, they sound grave warnings to the rest of us about our use of democracy even as they pocket another million pound bonus (Standard Life).

Which I think is one reason for ordinary Scots not taking seriously the grim-faced warnings from fat cats about the consequences of our own independence. I reckon most Scots look at the boss class and instinctively write off 90 per cent of what they say mainly because ‘they would say that, wouldn’t they?’ They know that the boss is never the one to suffer no matter what happens.

In my world hundreds of thousands of Scots who have never engaged directly in politics before are leaving their homes on dark nights to listen to speakers in public halls talk about a different way to run our country and about rediscovering our confidence as citizens and Scots. They are learning not to be afraid and not to be bullied. They learn not to trust what they are told just because that person wears a badge that reads MP, MSP or CBI (or SNP).  They see this is their world, it doesn’t belong to those who are well connected and who move effortlessly from one gilded role to another. They are demanding a say. They are growing inwardly, fired by the debate about independence but aware too that, even if it isn’t achieved, their political maturity is and they wont be cowed again, won’t be told to trust those who operate the machine. They are, even without knowing it, taking control for themselves.

Bill, in his piece, bemoans the idea that the argument will go on after the vote in September and how the timid pound pushers in finance are fed up with it. That is the view one who is bored or blind to what is really happening. This will not stop on September 19, win or lose. It is driven by its own momentum and it is the most powerful mass movement of modern times. It may not deliver independence of government this time, but it has already delivered a more confident and determined people who can feel the power surge in their hands. If it feels too hot to handle, they like it.

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53 thoughts on “Too Hot to Handle

  1. BOB MCCRACKEN

    Maybe he has lost his appetite for a debate,but you are right this will never stop now the genie is out of the bottle
    As far as i can see a massive amount of people have registered to vote,and I dont think its to vote against independence,I HOPE MY GUT IS RIGHT,AND WE WILL CELEBRATE SOON
    The million man march was outstanding in the States,and I would love someone to organise it here!!!!!
    WE CANNOT CRAWL BACK TO OUR CAVE AGAIN

  2. It seems to me people long ago gave up on the press or the opposition holding government to account, and have now embarked on a process of doing that themselves. This holding to account, this questioning, this discussion on what should be possible is surely what democracy should be about. We should not feel disempowered or disenfranchised, yet we have been for eons.

    The referendum has encouraged us to say enough is enough and that democracy now lies in our own hands. Those who are bored or antagonised by the process cannot truly believe in real democracy, but want us to return to a method of governance where rule is by the elite and the rest of us obediently tag along in their wake.

  3. I was in the Life Boys myself. I quickly got tired of the marching, but we did get to play the tubular bells in the old Waverley Market. I don’t think it turned me into a Presbyterian stormtrooper, and it may even have helped to awaken my interest in the Arts.

  4. Oh boy do I ever agree 110% with this post.

    These ‘suits’ don’t live on the front lines, they create them and the rest of society lives with the consequences. I’ve had my fill of of listening to the captains of industry and finance issue thinly veiled warnings over independence. The self same institutions which created austerity Britain wondering if their bonuses will be quite so big after independence. They frankly couldn’t give a stuff about democracy, social justice, constitutional change or electoral empowerment except in so far as it impinges upon that bonus.

    Well here’s the thing. This referendum is the first of its kind in British political history. A referendum where the electorate can actually pass judgement on their system of governance, their democracy. The suits can either get with the programme and help our country grow, participate and take advantage of opportunity in a Scotland open for business or they can follow through on their threats and up sticks.

    We can either let the corporate world and the politicians set the limits of our governance and aspirations or we can take this opportunity to set the limits of their influence over our lives.

    Roll on September. 🙂

  5. As always, your article puts things in perpective and makes me feel better.

  6. The saying about ‘knowing the price of everything, and the value of nothing’, describes quite a few unionists perfectly.

  7. The media no longer control the message and they are angry about it.

  8. More and more there is the feeling among the “Yes” campaign that we are at one very big turning point in history, not just of Scotland or even the UK at large but in the history of political ideology worldwide. Many people have commented on how “the world is watching”. Radical thinkers everywhere are opposed to the failed (yet still desperately trying to be dominant) orthodoxy that the power of the market should allow the creation of obscene wealth and power to fall into such a minuscule handful of people across the face of the earth.

    It’s not just the British Empire that is breathing its last – to all intents and purposes it went long ago. No, the power of that tiny world elite which is transnationally organised for its own benefit is facing a growing resistance worldwide from people who more and more recognise the gross obscenity inherent in extreme wealth and power co-existing with extreme poverty and powerlessness across the face of our planet. Gaia, the self-regulating, complex system that contributes to maintaining the conditions for life on our planet is itself threatened by those who can see nothing else but profit and power as the meaning of life. The risks to future generations of mankind are no concerns of these exploiters of people and of the earth’s resources. It is total madness disguised as economic theory enshrined in the particular political orthodoxy of the supreme power of the market.

    It is against that background that Scotland can reach out to another way and the world is sure as hell watching. They know we are reasonable people who have in the past offered much to mankind and are likely to do so again. They see the significance of our break from the final rump of the British Empire which was in its day the very archetypal epitome of exploitation both of people and resources. We could be signing the ultimate death warrant of that old relic of Britishness of mind with all its pompous exploitative glory when we put that wee cross against “Yes”. The world will want to know what we can put in its place.

    No wonder we in the “Yes” community feel so privileged and uplifted to live through this dramatic moment in time. Something really powerful and empowering is happening in oor wee country. it is clean and wholesome and right and bloody exciting to be part of. But imagine what history is going to say about the Alistair Darlings etc who lied and sold themselves to the devil to stand in our road. They are trashing their own lives in the eyes of future generations, and for what? That’s the thing I just cannot get my head round – what really motivates them to do what they have been doing to us?

    The coming spirit of the age at this point in time is so obviously with us and what we are aspiring to achieve in the overall journey of human ideas about quality of life. Are these naesayers blind to where mankind has to get to in compassion for our planet and for all who live on it, or is there nothing left in their souls except the need for more and more money and power?

    • I too am a fan of James Lovelock but have reservations about his ideas of a nuclear dump in his back garden as being a good prospect.
      Recent events in New Mexico might make that idea not such a good thing.
      We Scots are about to give democracy a long deserved boot in in the bum and hopefully will show humanity that people are in charge and not corporate executives.

  9. ” They see this is their world, it doesn’t belong to those who are well connected and who move effortlessly from one gilded role to another. ”

    How Khalil Gibran (1926) would have agreed with that, as in Speak to us of Buying and Selling :

    ” And before you leave the market- place, see that no one has gone his way with empty hands.
    For the master spirit of the earth shall not sleep peacefully upon the wind till the needs of the least of you are satisfied “

    • Margaret Brogan

      Thank you for quoting Kahlil Gibran. I have just looked out my copy of The Prophet. Elegant, compassionate and wise. Support and sustenance for the coming months, as well as Derek’s fierce posts!

  10. “the world I inhabit has never seemed so optimistic, inspired, communal and positive”

    “there is a sense of entitlement about our friends in suits that I find objectionable”

    Now that is the *business* Mr Bateman! Really enjoyed this one.

    Jamieson and his ilk in the press and not forgetting Boothman and co at the BBC are used to pontificating to the masses from on high. They talked and we listened. They had power and control.

    They were the opinion formers of our society. They controlled what we talked about, what we thought about. What we thought about the things going on around us.

    They were the pulse of the nation and were used to dictating the heart-rate of society. Now they don’t even have their fingers on the pulse. The people have reclaimed the heartbeat and the heart-rate of the nation to themselves.

    The power of the media has moved from the old institutions where the likes Bill Jamieson, John Boothman, John Teirnan and Simon Pia operate, to the internet. They have lost control and they don’t like it one little bit.

    The blogs like your own, Wings over Scotland, Bella Caledonia, Newsnet Scotland, Munguin’s Republic, Wee Ginger Dug, A Cybernet Writes, and Lallands Peat Worrier are on a daily basis dissolving the tissue of lies that they have spun us for decades.

    They can’t move for Twitter where their lies and spin are instantly spotted and called to account. Where they can be called to account. They do not like the scrutiny.

    They are reduced to calling us names and attempting to portray us as extremists who will stop at nothing to bring down their old establishments. In a sense they are right. We will bring down their old establishments. Their problem is that we are not doing it through extremism, we are doing it through truth, facts and reason. Difficult, nay, impossible to deny, no matter how many alternative

    They have held back the coming tsunami for decades but not for much longer. They will be swept away and they know it. They are cornered animals and they think if they just bite hard enough they will frighten us from our course. Not this time. Not ever again. We have started to awake and think for ourselves. A new and different Scotland is awakening. It will not be traduced or denigrated any more. It will be free.

  11. I went to a Better Together meeting in Musselburgh a few months back. Many of the people in the audience were Tory types from Inveresk (Inveresk is the Bearsden or Barnton of Musselburgh). It’s difficult to convey the sheer rage which these people displayed. Rage that those who they saw as beneath them might actually upset their apple cart. Rage that the system which allowed them to live in their comfortable little world of entitlement might come to an end. One gent summed it up when, during the Q&A session, he got up and said in a loud voice, “This is more of a rant than a question . . . “

    • Rage because they feel threatened, andygm1. Fight or flight mode. Fight at the moment but not for long. After a YES win they’ll change their tune.

  12. Oops second last paragraph shoud have finished:

    Difficult, nay, impossible to deny, no matter how many alternative stories they try to spin us.

    Not sure what happened there – crap multitasking I think ;-}

  13. I have to say that should Mr Jamieson suffer anything remotely like a Kristallnacht he has only himself to blame, since the thought was not in anyone’s head until he put it there.

    Personally, I like my revenge cold and financial. I would like to see the circulation of the Scotsman sink so low that they can’t even give the business away. Last I heard, was a rumour that October was down to 23,000.. Does it count as national any more? Can anyone calculate how long before they are just not viable?

    Oh, and I now wait for archive rather than give them traction on the internet site by visiting it.

  14. @bjsalba

    Re: Scotsman, I think they ceased being viable some time ago. I consider that they are being kept afloat by their Unionist backers until after the referendum, which if it is YES (My prediction is 73%+) it will be allowed to wither. In the unlikely event of a NO vote it may be resuscitated, but I consider that it is on its last legs.

  15. Fine article and always interesting comments. Just one minor point, Derek, but one phrase I wish jounalists would stop using is “ordinary people/Scots”. I feel all human beings are “extraordinary”in one way or another, and I believe Scots will prove it by voting Yes on the 18th, September.

  16. Bill Jamieson may be a ‘fine fellow’ or ‘good journalist’.

    Sorry Derek, utter crap.

    While you talk of ‘us’ – the ordinary people, the ones not in suits at the head of companies, the ones out of touch with everyday life, it’s sheer ignorance not too include many journalists into that category.

    Just because it’s your line of work doesn’t mean is doesn’t deserve to have the same disdain placed at it’s door.

    So quit it, please.

    Bill Jamieson is an arse. He’s a lackey to an imperialist paper that’s nothing more than an anti-SNP, anti-Yes, hate filled rag. It panders and prints any rubbish that Darling and co tell it.

    He does nothing to promoted the debate, to promote conversation, learning, research, willingness to listen, in short, there’s not one constructive aspect to his journalism.

    It’s written to divide, it’s written to cause outrage, it’s written to mock. It’s the classic example of everything you have rallied against in all your articles about ‘ how Scottish can you be when you want to be controlled by another country’.

    It’s designed to aggravate, possibly in the hope that someone will come along and put in the windows of The Hootsman so fed up are they of reading this shite.

    Project Fear have nowhere left to go. The fear didn’t work, the polls are narrowing. it’s too late to do a u-turn and offer up devo-max. the only route open to them is to become more extreme.

    I said it elsewhere today, with the level of crap being reported across the Scottish media, we can be sure that Project Fear will initiate some’ event ‘ to discredit the Yes campaign.

    When that happens, look out for Bill ‘Reichstag Fire’ Jamieson’s reporting.

    • Bravo Tartan Fever. You have highlighted one of Derek Bateman’s blind spots. He does not seem willing to criticise his former journalist colleagues. Always bending over to give them the benefit of the doubt.

      Jamieson is a prick and the term journalist should not be applied to his work. I’ll bet he was the person responsible for the disgusting front page photoshop in Scotland on Sunday which showed the saltire as a swastika superimposed on the iconic American picture of the flag raising on Iwo Jima.

  17. The future of Scotland lies in SME industries.
    These enterprises will be the fruits of our education system and social aspiration.
    Company officials who decide that they cannot operate in Scotland because of our beliefs have no future in our country and should emigrate to “foreign” countries who share their views.
    We need to move forwards and not backwards.

  18. Great Derek article but then I came across this, right at the very end

    “It may not deliver independence of government this time, ”

    Am I the only person who felt gutted ! We’re 6 months out from the vote with only a 5% swing needed. Momentum is behind YES

    Why conjure up defeat from the jaws of victory.

    • BOB MCCRACKEN

      must admit felt thatoo but dont think he is courting disaster,just sayin NO MATTER WHAT WE WONT STOP

  19. Cag-does-thinking

    Another great weblog, sometimes it’s something of a fountain which can re-invigorate the debate and point to where the argument is going. Certainly I detect that having largely lost the principal points the no campaign look to be embarking on the “Cybernats are Cybernazis” strand as used by the UKIP man in Scotland (I presume he is the only one….). The next tactic will to be to try shut down the debate by blaming everybody who supports independence for being an extremist. Some orthodox journalists are pretty rabid and they seem to resent being challenged robustly. Partly this is because they have nowhere else to go unless some major game changer comes along.

    As I commented on the other weblog the only danger of bracketing all business people with those who have strongly held political affiliations is that people in business have a range of viewpoints. Some support independence and some not. The same zealots that say they will relocate to England in spite have the view that independence is a bad idea not for any other reason than their personal political ideology. That isn’t necessarily the view of their shareholders and as we see some of them may lose business just through having their forceful opinion in the short term.

  20. Interestingly, I just got an email from 38 degrees about their campaign against the gagging law.

    Here’s what Ed Miliband said in his response to 38 Degrees members:

    “To hear from thousands of you was inspiring. It galvanised my belief that when people can stand up like you did and hold politicians to account our democracy is alive and well…”

    Ha, ha, ha. He’s right of course, but I know he doesn’t mean it.

    • @Catherine I too got an e-mail from 38 degrees, but with a survey by the Lib-Dems on my opinions as I indicated I ha had dealings Charlie Kennedy. . I think 38 degrees has been nobbled, The gagging act isn’t in force yet but the hack men for the Westminster political elite are already interfering with the organization.

      Interestingly, they normally give you a base text to work from. This time we had a blank page (well box). I did as 38 degrees asked and I was not abusive. but I would suspect that they will not like to hear what I told them.

  21. They think that a no in September is the end of all this nonsense about inclusion and independence and the Scots will lie down get their belly tickled, roll over and let the old crew back into their old habits at the horn of plenty. Game over?

    We are only at the start of a new world order. We have wakened up, sniffed the air and don’t like the stench, the game is up. Where we are going how we get there we know not but we are on the move. A new Scottish enlightenment is under way!

    Driven by the people of Scotland, all who want to be part of it. Those who don’t, get out of the way the flying Scotsman is coming through.

  22. smiling vulture

    As my Gran would say,it’s a bit of a leap,Sound of Music to Caledonian Krisallnacht’.

  23. A Truth and Reconciliation Commission? – The are usually set up to investigate wrong doing by a government – usually when a war ends or a tyrannical government is overthrown. It is quite extraordinary to hear terms like that bandied about by unionists. Given their record to date, such a farce would end up being a witch hunt and would create more division and anti-British sentiment. I don’t think these fools realise what a hatchet job they are doing to their own Union.

    The more the day approaches – the more convinced I become that if it is a no vote, there is no way in hell the Union will last a single term of another Westminster parliament. There simply is no way forward for the union in Scotland in the event of a no vote. None at all. They have made it all but impossible for those would vote yes to accept British identity ever again. For many it has become too divisive and odious. Ironically it will also make it impossible for Unionists too. As they will find themselves being mocked openly and made fools of for voting no. Not just by other nations, but by the rest of the UK.

    • It does make it clear that the Unionists view this as a war.

      I’ve said this before: It *is* a civil war. We’re just being more civilised about it.

  24. Sorry Derek I feel you are caught between a rock and a hard place here and you are obviously taking it easy on Jamieson as he is an old buffer and one of your peers perhaps? I agree with Tartan fever. Jamieson is an arse, I can say it but you cannot. He is a dyed in the wool conservative and unionist supermacist, all that is missing is the bowler hat and the sash.

    What do you think of Cochranes disgusting low life piece in the DT regarding the poor lassie that was killed at that school in Edinburgh? What a vile piece of shit he is.

    As to the announcment that we are to be subject to a Panavision of the blowing up of the Red Road Flats at the opening cermony of the Commonwealth games. I cannot help but feel that there is a deeply sinister motive behind it. The potential for disaster is very high on these jobs. But worse is the subliminal association in the mind of Scots who will be watching and very soon after voting in our referendum, with Scotland and destruction on a very larger scale. It was said that there will be a 100 metre screen at Parkhead to show it. That is the length of a football pitch dear Jesus Christ, where is that going to be? I think the Scottish Government should step in and put the calaboosh on that plan. It sounds like another Matheson cock up, if you will allow the pun. Remember Georges Square. He needs to be kept as far from these games as possible. We don’t need no explosions.

    • I just went to the Telegraph site and read his column. I don’t know when I last saw something as vile and disgusting as that, using the death of Keane Wallis-Bennet to have a go at the Scottish Parliament. I don’t think he even knew her name. There was also a sickening comment from a No voter about Liberton being where the toffs live.

      I’ve tried as hard as I can to stay calm and positive throughout this campaign. I don’t respond nastily to the vilest of the No brigade – I respond politely which infuriates them even more. I try and constructively encourage undecideds to seek out the facts, without trying to influence them unduly. But my patience is rapidly reaching breaking point. This is just too much. Are there no depths to which the media is prepared to sink? From non-reporting & pro-union spin to outright lies, treating our nation like shit, and now a vile piece like that! I have two daughters and I can hardly even begin to imagine what Keane’s parents are going through right now.

      Sorry for the rant. I’m actually a really positive Yes voter normally. It just gets a bit much sometimes.

  25. For those outside the YESnp’s optimistic bubble the separation debate is being conducted by increasingly angry nats and increasingly delusional trots.

    Amusingly Mr Bateman berates Mr Jamieson for using nazi terminology.

    Mr Jamieson should know better, him being a Gauleiter and all….

    • The only thing making us angry is having to listen to sneering self-righteous pricks like you. I suppose Alan Cochrane is right up your street.

      The one galling thing about the prospect of Scotland gaining it’s independence is that the benefits will also be enjoyed by you and your like, but that’s democracy.

      • Doug says: “I respond politely which infuriates..”

        In the next post Doug shrieks: “The only thing making us angry is having to listen to sneering self-righteous pricks like you”

        Are these two Dougs in any way related?

    • Such intemperate language. So the heat is also getting to you now? “nats” “trots” what age are you? You must be an embittered old man to be using such terminology.

      • Mr Coleman

        I didn’t realise that the term ‘nat’ was derogatory.

        Strange that the SNP described themselves as ‘nats’ in their election literature in 2011.

        • I really don’t like the term Cybernats as applied to YES voters. I am not a nationalist, but I am most definitely a YES.

        • I didn’t say they were derogatory. I implied they are old fashioned. And the SNP described themselves as Nats.

          • And what does YESnp even mean?

          • Catherine, he’s trying to imply that the whole Yes campaign is being masterminded by Alex Salmond and the SNP, and thus ignoring the fact that the biggest grassroots campaign in our history is going on underneath the radar of politics. He’ll take it sore enough though with the significant Yes result that will come in September. Let him waste his time sniping at the sidelines and lamenting the demise of his beloved New Labour fallacy.

            Admittedly, I lost it a wee bit with him further up in this post yesterday, cause I was still mad at the Telegraph using that poor little girls death to have a go at the Scottish Parliament. Normally though I can just smile and go “oh aye, is that right?” 🙂

  26. A Note of Caution – but only to secure the result.

    How many teams – in whatever sport – have gained a comfortable lead
    only to find that come the final whistle
    they found themselves on the losing side
    and all because of complacency
    and the belief that victory was secure
    when it wasn’t.

    So with the Referendum.
    Yes seems to have the momentum
    the tide most definitely has turned.
    But there is still a long way to go.
    ‘There’s many a slip ‘twixt cup and lip’.

    Threats and warnings we’ve had
    but BT has yet to play it’s master card –
    Bribery.
    Many a poor soul will fall for it
    times are hard
    they’ll take the bait
    Independence will have to wait.

    I may just be a little OT and off the pace
    I’ll let you decide
    but like any canny Scot
    I’ll keep a watchful eye wide open.
    For the Auld Enemy will not let Scotland go
    without fighting tooth and nail
    to hang on to his bounty.

    And at the last, you can be sure,
    he will offer us money
    in one form or another
    to entice us away
    from having our say
    and hence to betray
    not just a family or friend
    but a whole nation.

    Ps. Is it just me
    or do England’s rulers have a history of treachery?

  27. The frequent use of Nazi terminology from both Labour and Tory supporters is puzzling until you understand that their parties are part of the establishment and from that perspective have identical political viewpoints.

    I’m not sure if they’re copying the US tendency to personalise and demonise the opposition where the Yes campaign becomes nothing more than Alex Salmond and his henchmen or if it’s a consequence of the UK’s obsession with the Second World War. A threat to Britain becomes a Nazi threat by association.

    A much simpler explanation is that the political understanding of the establishment runs all the way from A to B. At point A are the parties who support the establishment and at point B are all the others, including Nazis.

    To put it in the simple terms they understand, if you’re not with us you’re a Nazi.

    • Both sides of this debate are guilty of seeing the mote in their opponent’s eye without realizing their view is obscured by a bloody great plank in their own.

      The SNP are not slow to use nazi terminology – why even the first minister accused a BBC employee of behaving like a nazi official. As a matter of course the SNP have called their political opponents Lord Snooty’s, thieves, traitors and have questioned the right of some folk even to comment.

      The tone of this debate started with a fractious tone and with each passing week the rhetoric from both sides escalates.

      Time for us to have a breather and ask ourselves who we are serving when we accuse our opponents of being nazis, thieves and traitors.

      • You are a brazen hypocrite writing that last paragraph while writing the drivel you do elsewhere.

        • I thank you for proving my point.

          • Sorry but what I wrote is the truth. It is brazen hypocrisy by you because you are a repeat offender constantly producing nasty posts in the debate.

            hypocrisy: 1. The practice of professing beliefs, feelings, etc, contrary to one’s real character or actual behaviour, esp the pretence of virtue and piety.
            2. An act or instance of this.

          • As hypocritical as it is James, it’s actually the closest I’ve ever seen him get to making a reasonable point. He started fairly well, but failed miserably on the final stretch (like the No campaign are doing).

            Actually, I called him a sneering self-righteous prick yesterday and I think it’s only fair that I apologise….

            I apologise to all sneering, self-righteous pricks for comparing you to this guy. I won’t let it happen again.

      • Struggling for the Hegemony there Gramhaski.

  28. Derek, thanks for these articles, you are putting into words beautifully and passionately what so many of us feel and believe, and more power to you for it. You were on fire in “Please Don’t Go” too, everyone with and without a vote should be made to read this. Couple this with the astonishing Scottish Input/output figures from 1900 to 1921 as outlined on Wings yesterday, and it is all too clear who the subsidy junkies really are, and It ain’t us.
    The sickening thing is that the likes of Darling know all this too, and still choose to talk down their country and lie to preserve their preferred status quo. Despicable.
    Rant over, and thanks again for the sheer quality of your blogging, have a glass of burgundy on me…

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