Toom Tabard

I know we’re poor but I had no idea it was this bad. We’re told oil prices are volatile and when they prove to be, erm, volatile, it is proof that we uniquely can’t look after our own budget. No, it must be left in the hands of those with a track record of looking after the national resources…the men and women who invested so wisely in an oil fund which smoothed our way through the financial crisis and who have avoided Britain running up debts of say, £1.3trillion pounds. I’m getting the picture now.

It seems that the concept of investment is one that has passed Alistair Darling by. One reason oil revenues are down is that the companies are using their money investing in new drilling areas and new ways of extracting oil. That is a good thing – not for this year’s revenues but for the future. If the industry wasn’t investing, you know what Darling would be crowing….they’re not investing any more, the North Sea is finished.

In fact it’s only months since Cameron was in Aberdeen as BP announced its massive investment West of Shetland when it was hailed as a major event for the British economy. And he’s been back since to show how Britain plays its role in the sector. The Unionists didn’t moan about investment then. (Alistair knows his master’s voice when he hears it)

There was also a prolonged shutdown of the Brent pipeline which hit production but such details are not required when talking to the Scots. Just as the sheep need not know what chemicals are in the sheep dip, so the gullible locals can be immersed in fabricated distortions about the oil boom being over. If I heard a calculated case calmly dismantling the public finances I might get worried. But what do I get?

Breathless, staring-eyed Darling falling over his words as he exults in running down his own people…the very man who not only oversaw the worst financial meltdown in 80 years but who, along with Brown, devised the very regulatory system that failed the country. I tweeted yesterday – yes, I’m getting the hang of it now – a clichéd line

How sad is it that Unionist Scots jump on news implying their own country is poorer than they thought? ‘We’re crap and proud of it!’ And I think that works because that’s all we hear. Darling is delighted the oil revenues are down. He’s chortling that Scotland’s income is less and the deficit is higher. He loves it. He doesn’t even pretend by manufacturing a sense of concern or disappointment, he just goes for it with relish. He is a man laughing all the way to the bank that his own country is poorer. What do we make of such a character? I always shy away from language like quisling because it has wartime connotations and implies treachery but I repeat, what do we make of a man thrilled to his boots that his fellow Scots are in a worse financial predicament? Shallow? Mean? Myopic? Or is it really an expression of the unpatriotic, the perverse or to call it as it is – anti-Scottish.

I believe a real politician can warn of financial problems and convey those warnings with gravitas and candour while expressing regret but that’s not what we get from the Unionist campaigners. We get sneer and triumphalism and a longer-term message that it serves us right.

With Danny Alexander I have to confess to feeling contempt of my own. I see a nice middle class lad with barely any formative experience of life, who has never been in charge of a company or organization or indeed of people, whose friendship (with Clegg) catapulted him from obscurity to the Treasury – he was originally destined for the Scotland Office backwater as the prize of his friendship – and who now lectures hard-pressed families that it is better for them to pick up benefits to eke out poverty wages and tells legions of men and women who ache for their country to be free to make its own decisions that they are unworthy of doing so. He has no wider vision of Scotland and is tightly focused on a political campaign so he is blinded to what he is conveying to the Scots. What is it in the education system that turns out individuals who can so casually belittle their own people in the interests of their own careers? Again my conclusion is not the most attractive but here it is anyway – they are not believers in Scotland – how could they be – but believers in Britain. Britain first, Scotland second. Britain good, Scotland not too bad. Scotland independent? Do me a favour…

This was rather confirmed for me today by a piece of writing in the Herald by a very nice person whom I like dearly, Catherine Macleod, who is known to both Alistair and Danny. She was adviser to Darling when he was Chancellor and they are both deeply committed Britnats. In this item she expresses amazement at the idea of Scotland functioning independently and says there is no such thing as independence and the whole idea she dismisses as if it’s silly childish affectation that keeps people from focusing on matters of real importance.

It is a breathtaking view of your own country but it is typical. When Darling said a currency union was a good idea he added that we have one now so why go through all the complications of independence to end up where we are today. I shouted at the screen: Because we want to have our nationhood. Scotland is our nation, not Britain and once we’ve got independence we will decide – not London- what currency we use and what other decisions we make. It’s called independence.

And Catherine and Alistair just don’t get it. They literally do not think of Scotland as a nation or a country or an entity that could or should express itself on a world stage. Scotland is a wee place that rightly sits inside Britain where all the good and talented people, like themselves, go south to make money and progress. It is an old story in our history and they are victims of it, held enthrall to the power of London. But it has robbed them of the of the natural means of national expression that brings joy and a sense of freedom to all the other people of the world and leaves them emasculated when confronted by the Yes movement’s love of Scotland and aspiration for her. They both know the Highland and Islands of our country, as does Alexander, but is that it? Do they just love the scenery and are blind to the potential? Doesn’t their Scottishness zing in them and drive them to express it? Don’t they look at other Scots and see people capable and better at running their own affairs? Or is that a daft dream of the little people they left behind.

I think pity is in order.

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100 thoughts on “Toom Tabard

  1. quisling is a very descriptive word,i have often thought what to call them….perfect
    i am also at a loss to understand how they can beliitle their own country,for political gain

    • Unlike Derek, but like you Bob I have no qualms in calling these “proud scots” exactly what they are. In fact one of my sons suggested yesterday that we could put the lamposts in George Square to good use following a Yes vote on the 18th.

      • @Alex

        That last sentence in your post does not help the debate or our cause at all. I agree that unionists’ attitude to Scotland is a disgrace and it can anger us all greatly. However, that comment is not going to help the Yes campaign at all, quite the reverse is true.

      • Alex, I understand how you feel about these people but references to lamp posts just play into their hands and those of the Daily Heil’s smear campaign. Let’s leave the public statements of violence and retribution to the Ian Davidsons and the George Foulk-ups of this world, bud.

      • That sounds quite sinister, and it’s both extremely unhelpful and unwelcome to the debate. Perhaps the sort of response to be expected during the Bolshevik revolution, but not in 21st century Scotland.

    • “Cultural Invasion: In this phenomenon, The invaders penetrate the cultural context of another group and, ignoring the potential of the latter, they impose their own view of the world upon those they invade and inhibit the creativity of the invaded by curbing their expression”
      “For cultural invasion to succeed, it is essential that those invaded become convinced of their intrinsic inferiority”
      Paulo Freire : Pedagogy of the Oppressed

    • As Burns said ” Such a parcel of rogues in a nation” when he wrote about our first shafting in 1707, we were rogered again in the 70s, let’s hope we can get it right at the third attempt……

  2. Can we bottle this one Derek? You could make a fortune!

  3. Self-hate is a usually a result of depression.

  4. Business Scotland has some very good articles breaking down the GERS figures and showing that Scotland is paying billions extra for services we don’t get. The Treasury can also manipulate the oil tax revenues by altering the tax regime thus encouraging companies to drill less and invest more. This needs to be made public in any media piece about GERS but let’s not hold our breath. Danny and Ali & Co will lose their enormous London salaries and expenses claims, with future seats in the £300 a day for turning up Lords, if Scotland votes for independence. Pure self interest drives them.

  5. Superb piece again Derek. You managed to put into writing exactly how I feel when I hear Darling and the other BritNats rubbishing Scotland.

  6. Don’t hold back now, Derek.
    What a masterly exposition of those political pygmies.
    There is a very telling cartoon by Calman along the same lines in today’s Herald

  7. Apologies, should be Business for Scotland here http://www.businessforscotland.co.uk/

  8. Every time I see Alistair Darling excitedly frothing at the mouth, I’m longing for an interviewer to say:”Alistair, Alistair, calm down man!” I half expect Darling to break into Renton’s speech from Trainspotting:”It’s shite being Scottish! We’re the lowest of the low! The scum of the fucking Earth!”

  9. Poor Danny Alexander has been led astray by Provincials. Hope he sees the error of his ways. Darling is beyond redemption.

  10. I do hope Alan Mackintosh does not mind me using his comment from Wings over Scotland yesterday, I thought it was so apt! I want to let everyone read this amazing quote.
    I will now whip over to Wings and confess to what I have done.

    Alan Mackintosh says:
    12 March, 2014 at 9:16 pm
    Re Darling, Carmichael, etc. Words of wisdom echo down through the ages. It is to our peril if we fail to heed them.

    “A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murderer is less to fear. The traitor is the plague.”

    Marcus Tullius Cicero (Ancient Roman Lawyer, Writer, Scholar, Orator and Statesman, 106 BC-43 BC

  11. Why is it every time I open one of your blogs these days Mr Bateman, I stand up and applaud the computer monitor? I’m glad no one can see me do it.

    PS, I just released my own take on the diminished oil revenues, I do hope you take the time to have a read.

    http://ncdiblog.wordpress.com/2014/03/13/the-taxman-and-the-corporate-oil-investor/

    Kindest regards,

    David Milligan Lvss

    • Hi David,

      Thanks for the link to your blog. Thats a very good article, it clearly explains exactly what’s what regarding GERS and oil revenues. If anyone’s looking for a user friendly explanation, David provides it.

    • David I’m going mad trying to figure out how to subscribe to your blog. I can’t find the box to enter my email address, do you have one that I’m just not seeing?

  12. I was reading “Living with Lies” by Nick Cohen the other week where he revealed, without a hint of irony or bathos, that A Darling once told him that colleagues urged him not to be so “left wing”. Left wing!!

  13. “I know we’re poor…” No Derek, were not poor, just donating our wealth to the charity that is London.

  14. Greatly put Derek, let’s make a stand for what is right and what our country can achieve?!

  15. katrina macgregor

    Derek, would you mind if I tweeted part/parts of your blogs to reinforce the importance of a yes vote?

    thanks, Katrina

  16. And Catherine and Alistair just don’t get it. They literally do not think of Scotland as a nation or a country or an entity that could or should express itself on a world stage.

    Unionists in Scotland generally do not think of Scotland as a nation. This is because of the basic premise that nations are independent, and run their own affairs. They often say that Scotland is a nation, but they do not really believe it. Usually they refer to Britain as the rest of the country, which kind of gives the game away. Also, they talk about how there is no border between Scotland and England, when in actual fact there is of course a physical border between the two nations. Unionist political representatives in Scotland are generally British nationalists, but they cannot admit it. This is because they have spent the last 40 or so years attacking nationalism, which by that they mean Scottish nationalism. Independence for Scotland is obviously a profound threat to their careers, their privileges, and their status in Scottish and UK society.

    • It is interesting that Derek should choose Toom Tabard for the title today.. I wondered what Wikipedia would say about him :-

      “He submitted his claim to the Scottish auditors with King Edward I of England as the arbitrator”

      “Edward I, who had coerced recognition as Lord Paramount of Scotland, the feudal superior of the realm, steadily undermined John’s authority. He demanded homage to be paid towards himself, legal authority over the Scottish King in any disputes brought against him by his own subjects, contribution towards the costs for the defence of England, and military support was expected in his war against France. He treated Scotland as a feudal vassal state and repeatedly humiliated the new king. The Scots soon tired of their deeply compromised king; the direction of affairs was allegedly taken out of his hands by the leading men of the kingdom, who appointed a council of twelve—in practice, a new panel of Guardians—at Stirling in July 1295”

      Much of that has a distinctly contemporary ring to it doesn’t it? Southern power has always loved to rub our nose in the shit, and worse of course, (think Butcher Cumberland). Yet I don’t think Toom Tabard ever had the full quisling status of our darling Alistair, TT was weak but at least he did try to be loyal to his own country and took no joy from its humiliation. How do Darling boy Alastair and the other quislings look themselves in the mirror of a morning without noticing the betrayal written all over their face?

      It is also interesting the route Scotland took after Toom Tabard – to independence by 1314. It’s got a nice ring of symmetry about it that hasn’t it?

      We have been taught to cringe at “Scots Wha Hae” and “Flower of Scotland” as kitsch kailyard nonsense by those who are ashamed of their own heritage. They want us to turn our ever-so-humble backs on all those many centuries of human struggle, and instead try to be some nondescript dried-up “modern” country with no past worth mentioning.

      It’s those dried-up nondescript grovelling people who want to remake Scotland in their own image and who wilfully endeavour to peddle this collective amnesia of our past in favour of Britishness who have very effectively emasculated part of the identity of who we are. We have for too long neglected our own history in our schools and been brainwashed into a deprecating apology for who we are. Why be ashamed of it when the rest of the world since the time of the Waverley Novels has loved the romance of all that rich human endeavour?

      Our identity will be reborn internationally when we “rise now and be the nation again”. People from around the world will be ever more keen to come here knowing that we threaten nobody with nuclear weapons or illegal wars which seek to artificially bolster up a steadily dying British national prestige. The egalitarianism which others recognise as inherent in our Scottish culture and which puts a friendly smile on faces around the world towards us will hold the door of welcome open as we have aye done.

      • I knew Roy and liked his music, but I think even he was surprised at the popularity of Flower of Scotland. Personally I don’t like it much. As for Scott he was an avid unionist who, I understand, felt that denigration and condescension was a price worth paying for improved economic conditions. At least he wasn’t seduced by the London lifestyle. I think a lot of his writing was poor as well.

    • I can only apologise to yourself, and anyone else if they were offended, but after reading the report of the C.P.A.G I was incensed by what Westminster is planning, and these smug b……s ensconsed by their, well they think anyway, place in the establishment, secure in the knowledge that even although the electorate throw them out, they will still get a sinecure probably in the House of Lords. I have one great-grand child and I don’t want him to suffer this fate. Once again apolgies to all but I was very angry zt the time of my post. Not that I’m much better now.

  17. Blair paterson

    As far as I know Alastair darling was born in London so he is not scottish

    • It’s not about where you were born. That’s only part of it. Of course you can be born in London and be Scottish.

  18. Jim Kennedy Cairo

    After the 18th and we are free, these same people will think they can come to Holyrood and show us how it is done. It could be why we have J Lamont & co there, keeping seats warm.

  19. Jings Derek but your blogs are getting bleaker by the day.

    I’ve been concerned for some time at the way the YESnp campaign has attempted to portray those Scots who believe our country is best served remaining part of the UK as somehow being less ‘Scottish’.

    That line of argument always seemed to me to be particularly petty and snarky.

    This uncharacteristically ill-considered and at times offensive rant has certainly moved that along somewhat.

    Which is a pity because on September 19th we’re all going to have to live together regardless of the outcome – although with the increased venom coming from YESnp I rather suspect that the coffee has been smelled and the writing on the wall has been read over at SNP HQ.

    Perhaps we should reflect on the impact of our rhetoric before we launch any more divisive and to be honest nasty attacks on those with whom we disagree?

    • The irony of this contribution is, of course, it that the No Scotland coalition have done nothing but launch nasty, ad hominem attacks on Alex Salmond for the entirety of the campaign, as well as attacking and disparaging the very idea of Scotland itself. So perhaps you ought to give your advice to those on that side of the debate, because some realism (perhaps, even, maturity of debate) is needed from those who claim to be standing up for the Union.

    • You clearly missed the Express report at the weekend and the paper, presented to the HOuse of Commons, by Dr Mark Shephard, the paper by the professor from the University of the West of Scotland on BBC Scotland bias, which laid most of the nastiness at the door of unionism. Perhaps you should reflect on the impact of your rhetoric and thinking. You are happy to continue condemning people in Scotland to poverty while Westminster continues to rob us at the rate of £170 per second – and it’s not as if they help the needy in the rUK with our stolen assets. You really need to smell the coffee and open your mind to the possibilities of socialism in Scotland which the rUk, excepting the masters of the universe in London, would like to follow. Yes, Grahamski, lets “be honest” – we know who the nasties are in this debate as do all neutral onlookers.

    • More synthetic outrage from the fear pedlars. Your entire prospectus is based on insult and undermining confidence and when it comes back at you, you do the mime artist horror routine. I actually state in the blog how a No message can be made acceptable and I agree there is principled Unionism. But this opportunistic, anti Scottish pastiche for political debate demeans us all, especially you since your side is rubbishing your own people. Get a spine, man. As for living together afterwards… is that those folk in Easterhouse in dreary flats with no shops, no car, bad health, no job, food banks and crime living (not exactly cheek by jowl) with £170,000 in EXTRA earnings Alistair in stone-built, detached, large garden with gazebo Merchiston and a croft in Lewis? Aye, they’ll be living together afterwards, right enough. What’s wrong? Scared of passion? Remember when Labour had some of that? Long time ago now and it’s not coming back.

      • Not outraged, merely saddened by a distinct change in tone to the debate.

        It is genuinely disappointing that you attempt to portray arguments against yours as being anti-Scottish. There is a whiff of something not quite right about that kind of thing.

        I welcome passion to the debate and I respect the opinions of those who believe a YES vote is in Scotland’s best interests. I do not believe them to be deceitful to anybody but themselves, however, I find it troubling that there are many on the YES side who refuse to believe that their opponents are honourable and belive the only way to hold a counter opinion is do so deceitfully.

        This way leads to the kind of dirty and evil politics with which the world should have rid itself by now.

        • A change of tone? Aren’t you the guy whose posts drip with sarcasm and contempt and are designed to wind up people who put their country first? You lace them barbs which pour scorn on others. I don’t buy the transformation into Mother Theresa. How long do you think Scots will tolerate this orchestrated lack of respect? Where else on earth could they get away with rubbishing their own country? Do you support them? Politicians are supposed to take care with their statements as they are, even in a campaign, supposed to represent all. That’s not how I feel listening to Darling and Alexander. Also, I’m not a politician, I’m not in the mainstream media and use the blog to rant my own views and it seems they chime with thousands every day – up to 13,200. If you don’t like it, sir why don’t you blog? Instead of skulking in the background tripping everybody up, get your own blog site and tell us what you believe, why Britain is best, why Johann is a leader and why 900,000 Scots in poverty is a price worthy paying. You can adopt your holier than thou attitude and see how many followers you get. I promise to be one. Have you tried Ian Smart – “Scots prefer a flag to solving starvation” etc. If you don’t want your own site, write for mine. there you are – give me 800 words on Grahamski’s Britain and i’ll publish it. But mind, be nice to everyone.

      • Derek,

        Not content to skulk in the background tripping your followers up ( I prefer to characterise my posts as correcting your followers’ misunderstandings, but that’s another story) I spend most of my time knocking on the doors of my fellow bairns campaigning for Labour. I have a blog – and it’s a doozy – you can find it here:

        http://grahamskisreferendum.blogspot.co.uk/

        I haven’t posted recently because….well, because the campaign has been so dreary, really.

        Will start posting regularly when the campaign starts proper in June.

    • Grahamski, tell me, do you cut yourself off from all external influences to give you time to concoct what you consider to be an interesting contribution, and then just randomly throw it into the mix in the hope that it will provide food for thought for people whose reasoned arguments make yours sound like something glued together from the contents of a cross-cut shredder. Your latest offering is about as relevant to Derek’s article as the chemical analysis of a burger bun is to a discussion on 14th-century Swedish poetry.

    • Outrage from the man who uses the phrase ‘YESnp’. He’s worried about ‘the impact of rhetoric’

      What a troll.

    • You obviously haven’t read about the latest Daily Record Poll. Time to come out of the rat holes where BnpT hide and find out what’s happening in the real world.

    • http://wingsoverscotland.com/the-missing-millions

      The C2D2 people in Scotland who hardly ever vote or have never been registered to vote are overwhelmingly inclined towards Yes. They are getting registered, on their own initiative or helped by RIC and others and they are invisible to the pollsters. Something like 34% of the populace of Anniesland voted in the last election. If we can get that up significantly and repeat it in other deprived wards then we will win.

      On September 18, or the 19th if they make us wait that long, watch the returns for the voting figures for such places. If the turnout is high, we will have won.

    • Margaret Brogan

      Grahamski, is that really your name? I find what you say incomprehensible. Why do you keep mis-typing. Make a mistake once and learn from it, or use spell check.
      Punctuation is poor.
      The text is rambling and accusatory, difficult to follow.
      Try to be clearer and more focussed in your approach next time. You’ll feel better and you may produce something sensible.
      Avoid posting comments when you are bilious, it always shows.

    • Unionists like yourself Grahamski, seem to forget that the referendum is about Scottish self-determination & not narrow politics. I think your references to the SNP reveal the real target in your line of fire! For those of us who wish the democratic deficit to be addressed, so that we don’t get the governments we don’t vote for, it’s a notion far greater & indeed nobler than what the Union offers.
      That is why we on the Yes side find it bewildering when Scottish politicians on the other side take such obvious glee in denigrating their fellow Scots. The same people who, after a Yes vote, will have to eat some considerable humble pie & start fighting for Scotland’s interests; frankly untenable positions to some.
      How do you think you’ll manage to reconcile your obvious dislike for the SNP when we wake on the 19th September to an independent Scotland?

      • Mr Borland

        The people advocating, organising and running this referendum have made it absolutely clear that a YES vote is a vote for the SNP manifesto as contained in their so-called white paper.

        In the unlikely event of a YES vote I will accept the will of the Scottish people work to make my country a successful and better place.

  20. Why are these people including the EBC/STV & MSM Scots prepared to betray their country and it’s people, or is it sell their country? Maybe that is the simple answer MONEY, and slithering up the management greasy pole, to more MONEY, and crawling to the upper echelons of our masters, to more MONEY. Think quisling is the correct word derek, money and social status the motivators, it even suppresses emotions and feelings.

  21. Derek not only do they have a different view of their country, they have a different view full stop.
    A view where it is acceptable to prop up a financial system where there is only one way to keep the system going. Increase the interest rate ( to avoid a bubble) but pass the impact of that onto the public or lower interest rates ( to check the economy) and pass the impact onto the public. There is no mechanism to change or appease the financial system -let the public take the brunt either way. Money rules .
    I include Alistair Darlings advisor you quote in my disdain for their insular, rabbit in the headlights outlook.
    It would be interesting to find out just what kind of contact any if the three mentioned have with ‘ ordinary people’ ? The half asleep drunk on the bus, the crabbit woman behind the counter, the old guy who has seen it all and done it all and through a funny remark or a kind gesture can make your day and make you glad you live where you do.
    What kind of personality do you have, where you know you are thought of with contempt by your peers, you as a person trashed (as AD was as Chancellor) all over the papers yet you are not only able to carry on , you actively seek that role?
    The great and the good management team who have been allowed to oversee the direction of Britain have failed miserably and offer nothing but more of the same whatever colour.Alistair Darling , Danny Alexander or any of the advisors are nothing more than ducks. Appearing to glide effortlessly across the surface but paddling like hell underneath to maintain their positions, at some point they will reach dry land and realise the swans have moved in .

  22. Danny Alexander and the liberals think Scotland is a place to collect buterflies. Darling and co think it is a place to get a safe labour seat for life. Between the two of them they can’t wait for news that Scotland is in financial ruin. Ironically in order to back up their case for staying in the UK!

  23. good stuff, to me they are worse than quislings, if their reasons for staying in the grip of London was valid i would respect those views. But lies, smears and sneers for their own self interest is sickening to the stomach. I empathise with alex but agree it is negative.

  24. Meanwhile squeaky bum time for Darling:

    Todays Scotsman:

    13 March
    2014
    11:44

    80 comments

    Tweet

    Print this

    Sponsored by

    SUPPORT for Scottish independence has reached its highest level for more than six months, according to a new opinion poll.

    When asked how they would vote if the referendum was held today, 39.3 per cent of those surveyed said Yes, compared to 47.6 per cent who said No.

    The remaining 13.1 per cent of those who were questioned were undecided according to the poll, by Survation for The Daily Record and Dundee University.

    It is the highest support for independence since August last year, when a poll by Panelbase found 44 per cent of people backed Scotland leaving the UK.

    Survation questioned 1,002 people aged 16 and over between March 6 and March 7, and also looked at how Scots could vote in the next Holyrood election.

    That put the SNP ahead of Labour, with 44.6 per cent of people saying they would vote for Alex Salmond’s party in the constituency section of the ballot and 34 per cent planning on supporting Johann Lamont’s party.

  25. I found this from the Scots dictionary.

    Snuil: A spiritless, cringing, abject or cowardly person, a mean, furtive or underhand person.

  26. lastchancetoshine

    “And Catherine and Alistair just don’t get it. They literally do not think of Scotland as a nation or a country or an entity that could or should express itself on a world stage.”

    They get it perfectly well, it’s just not in THEIR interests and it’s everybody else’s job to do what they tell us. What they don’t get is a thing called empathy (in the broadest sense).

  27. My 17 year daughter who was born and raised in SE England has shown a deep interest in the Scottish independence debate. It’s maybe no surprise as she has always enjoyed her times in Scotland and, I guess, I talk about it a lot. Her big interest at school (and hopefully on into Uni) is Psychology.

    I was mentioning to her the ‘No’ campaign’s reaction to the latest economic figures. She was already aware of their negative tendencies on pretty much every aspect of Scottish economic and social life prior to this anyway. I commented that, for me, this seemed to be backfiring as many ‘undecided’ and even former ‘no’ voters seemed turned off by their unrelentingly negative approach.

    Her reaction was to see this movement as obvious – “you do not influence people’s behaviour to the way you want it by damaging their pride”. This “pride” is quite different to the “proud Scot” rhetoric. It’s nothing to do with your perception of nationality, but rather the place and community you live in. At some point the negative slant against all the things where you live starts to sound like a personal attack.

  28. British nationalists remind me of the female members of anti-suffrage leagues from 100 years ago. My guess is that a generation after independence (whether it happens this year, or at another time) no one will admit to having voting no.

  29. There are certain people,because of the effort they are putting in to prevent a Scottish state from emerging,who will have no place in the governance of Scotland after independence.
    How would anyone trust them knowing that their position is anti Scotland.
    Burning your boats comes to mind.

    • Poacher turn gamekeeper comes to mind. I suspect that Alistair Darling and Danny Alexander will reveal themselves as ultra-nationalists if Scots vote YES. Whether we trust them or not is an entirely different matter.

  30. I think Alistair Darling is a great recruiting sergeant for the YES campaign.

  31. Just watching First Minister’s Questions. Ruth Davidson and Johann Lamont are priceless and Alex Salmond is very capable of turning their daft questions back at them so that they look as if they are doing Westminster/London’s bidding. Well done First Minister. PS Ruth Davidson referred to Alex as a ‘chancer’. Mature debate, Grahamski??????????????

  32. Not “held enthrall, Derek.
    Held in thrall.
    thrall |θrɔːl|
    noun
    1 [ mass noun ] literary the state of being in someone’s power, or of having great power over someone: she was in thrall to her abusive husband.
    2 archaic a slave, servant, or captive.

  33. OK. I’ve read the Catherine MacLeod column in today’s Herald and very poor and uninformed it is, In fact, it would sit better in the tabloids. She states that no country is independent but forgets that every country in the EU is independent and interindependent, however, at the end of the day run their own affairs and wouldn’t dream of being run by another country. They all operate on equal terms. And, depressingly, on she goes. She forgets that most people who read the Herald are educated and mostly professional people who will view her column as intellectually very poor. It deserves all the criticism it will attract.

    Good news from the Daily Record, of all papers, that support for the YES campaign has gone up, however, it was well hidden. If it had been the other way round, it would have been flagged up on the front page.

  34. Oh dear derek. The pressure is clearly starting to get to you. In one blog you have gone from someone who tries to hold themselves out as a supposed half serious independence blogger to throwing words like “quisling” and “anti-scottish” about. As much as you wont believe me, i did have a little respect for you and we did have the odd intelligent exchange. However, i have noticed that recently your blogs have been becoming less coherent and more extreme in their tone. You are clearly playing to your adoring audience who judging from the comments above are hearing exactly what they want to hear from you. I think that today’s rantings are the icing on the cake and i’m afraid to say you have well and truly lost it. You have descended to the levels of the more extreme visitors to your site and some of the comments above show exactly why many scots view YES campaigners as dangerous extremists. You should take a good look at yourself in the mirror and if you are honest with yourself i doubt you’ll like what is staring back at you.

    • Another Holy Willie here – read the press, listen to BBC Scotland and tell us how much respect you have for them. Remember that we, like you probably, pay them to mislead and distort reality. Tell me how much you respect them!! Ii’s easy to appear coherent when you say nothing except to criticize others whose views don’t fit yours – that’s extremism. All your pejorative comments John are just that – comment from someone who can’t bear another point of view. You look in the mirror before you imply someone else is dishonest. How dare you come out with this pious claptrap without having anything positive to put forward! Sorry, Derek, I know you are well enough equipped to deal with this hypocrisy!

    • For McMad
      In a conflict of ideologies such as we find in this referendum debate which is in essence between those who see the future of Scotland as part of the UK and those who wish to see self governance for Scotland surely you would expect both sides to make a positive case each for its own position.

      Could you in that case please point me to where I can find, anywhere, a truly positive case for staying in the union. Before you answer that just pause and look in that mirror that you were talking about and ask yourself in full honesty, am I capable of making a soundly reasoned positive argument for Scotland remaining as part of the UK or am I just taking masochistic malevolent pleasure of a repressed pseudo sexual nature out of abusing people I personally disagree with – and enjoying the kinky vibes you get from that.

      If you can’t offer reasoned argument, abuse of others whether sexual or otherwise can only give you deviant pleasure and does not in any way constitute argument or debate. It is very easy for you to come on here and collectively abuse others who are trying to articulate a positive vision for their country.

      People who go out of their way to take pleasure at misfortunes whether real of imagined that they see visited on their native land and actively work to aid and abet such circumstances I think you will agree (looking truly into that mirror again) must earn the right to be called quislings.

      • So calling your opponents “quislings” and inspiring the weak minded to call for these opponents to be hung from lamp posts passes for reasoned debate in the warped mind of a nationalist does it? As for your weird sexual obsession, your post is one of the oddest i have ever read. You really are strange one, clearly the impending defeat has got to you too.

        ps. Thanks so much for proving my point.

  35. I have a sort of technical interest in the mental mechanics of Darling and his all too numerous like. Does he know he is lying? If he doesn’t, he is of very low intelligence. Does he have sufficient grasp of reason to know that what he says not just untrue, but untrue in a malevolent and calculated way? I don’t know.

    In people like Darling, Lamont, Gray and many others from the Labour Party I think we see a kind of political autism – an inability to react appropriately, or to understand the reactions of others – complete atrophy of empathy. World wars have grown out of this emotional deficiency in political leaders.

    What gloomy thoughts I’m having tonight.

    • They are politicians. One reason I have never joined a political party is because as a scientist I care about the truth as well as being honest when we don’t know or cannot tell.

      I was a champion debater at school and won a best speaker award at an open impromptu debating contest arguing a position completely contrary to the one I actually held. The audience were nodding away and I could feel I held them in the palm of my hand. It was intoxicating.

      To people who crave attention and personal validation that feeling must be like heroin.

      But to me doing that in a debating competition is one thing, but swallowing a falsehood the party bosses want you to push to people on the doorstep or in the hustings? that is a different thing entirely. It’s the same reason I did not become a con man and couldn’t sell for toffee when I tried it as a student, when it was someone’s money at stake it stopped being fun.

      Now look at what happens to junior MP’s when they volunteer to go on the media and support he insupportable. They get preferment and promotion. So doing what Darling and Co are doing is something they have been doing for years, decades in Darling’s case. In essence it’s the classic ends justify the means scenario. They are good people, they know they are. They believe they know the right solutions to things and telling a white lie, lying by omission or just ‘spinning a story’ are all valid debating tools. So the game becomes simply, ‘what do we have to say to get this done or stop that?’

      I don’t see it as any sort of psychological mystery. People have been ever thus.

    • Some people think the blink rate tells its own story….

    • Thats it exactly! Sorry if it makes you more miserable but you left oot the biggest of them all……Broon

    • So McMad you don’t like being called a “quisling” – whether it was aimed at you or not – a need for self-importance maybe? But you don’t mind calling people, who are so unfortunate as to disagree with you, as “weak-minded” and “warped” and having a “weird sexual obsession” – all seekers after justice for their country and it’s independence are like that of course. Typical bullying unionist mind-set – i’ll call you whatever I want but don’t you dare say anything about me – how very Tory! how very hypocritical! How very YOU!

  36. Jock Erskine Dun Eden

    Banish those “gloomy thoughts” vronsky! Have a look at this link over at Wings http://wingsoverscotland.com/as-bad-as-each-other/#more-51725 Just an aside, I am worried about your foray into trying to understand the mental machinations and contortions of Flipper Darling. It’s a dangerous place to go, be afraid, be very afraid

  37. Another great piece of writing Derek! You are able to put into words what many of us feel. Can I also add that under no circumstances should the Bitter together brigade who come on and try to stir the shit be taken on. Let them have their say!!! No need to respond!!! Carry on as if they have not posted. Then their pathetic diatribe will be lost in the sea of positivity. Keep up the good work Derek. We shall win the day.

  38. Caution, Derek, it’s a trap. The doom, gloom, despair rhetoric has two purposes. The first, obviouslly, is to terrify those who are weak of spine. But the second is to provoke reaction – push people into making the kind of comments where the vile cybernat (and worse) label can stick.
    We’ve seen several trial runs at this. ‘Anti-English hatred’ ‘Online death threats’ etc. So far, they’ve been laughed off – but this theme will be revisited in spades, and it will be ‘No voters to be ostracised/told they are betraying their nation’ leading on to “frothing Braveheart Alex Salmond followers threaten to burn out quislings….” I don’t have to tell you how it goes.

    They have a lot of ammunition left. Behind the pathetic figures in the front line there will be some silky and ruthless people who have dined long and well on the literature of how to win a dirty propaganda battle.

    Keep the heid.

  39. Balliol didn’t do too well in his dealings with the southern ruler of his time – Ed the 1st wasn’t It? And he was chosen because of his lack of courage and “empty shirt”. In other words, easily manipulated. Now we have a whole row of toom tabards working their socks off for GO & his friends. The difference is that the original fellow DID show a degree of loyalty to his country. The modern lot seem only to be interested in the cash prize offered by Westminster. Poor Toom Tabard ended his days in France. Pity the French if after September 18th they have to give succour to Alasdair Darling, Danny Alexander etc. etc. etc……

    • They wouldn’t be the first since Tabard to end their days in France either. Napoleon had a Marshal called MacDonald. Son of a Jacobite who fled after the ’45.

    • No way will Flipper et al. move to France; have you seen the tax rates that the French are demanding on the sort of income promised for their performance? No they’ll move South and wait for Ed to reduce the top rate to 40%!

      /* irony off */

  40. Dearie me Derek – you’re in danger of becoming a thorn in the side establishment – someone who just doesn’t know his place in the natural order of things….. keep up the good work. 🙂

  41. Derek, I don’t think Darling and Alexander (and this MacLeod person) come out with the rubbish they do because they’re Britnats first and foremost. I think it’s much sadder than that. We Scots know we are inferior if we buy into the tripe we heard at school and still see around us. And if we buy into that, but somehow reach the dizzy heights of a Flipper or Alexander, imagine what that means – we have escaped from the lumpen mass that wants to drag us down. We’ve made it – sod the rest of you! The colonised mind is a sad and embarrassing thing to see, especially when linked into a well developed Stockholm Syndrome. Poor Flipper. Poor Alexander.

  42. The large unicycling pachyderm in the room whenever some pillock from BT or Westminster starts waxing lyrical on Scottish economic aspirations. £1.3tr in debt and climbing for the foreseeable future, coupled with a chasm in social division and topped with one of the widest rich/poor divides in the developed world. On this track record we’re meant to take their words of wisdom seriously. On this track record they believe they have the right to say this far and no farther to the Scottish electorate. This state machine, this establishment, this economic model is their legacy. UK PLC.

    On the evidence still unicycling round the room and by this point waving a neon sign saying ‘FFS LOOK AT ME’, is anyone still willing to buy into Better Together’s line on Scotland?

  43. Here Derek, this’ll put a smile on yer pan.

    http://www.newsnetscotland.com/index.php/scottish-news/8878-poll-boost-for-yes-as-indy-race-hots-up

    Weeks of high level pounding and we’re still breathing down their necks. 🙂

  44. I want to introduce a new term into the Independence debate. There have been people on here complaining about “Bolshevik ” tendencies. Actually, those who do so are spiritual “Czarists”. God save Grand Duchess Elizabeth, and Archduke Phillip!. From 1914 to 2014. These people have learned nothing. As an Irish citizen, I am always astonished at the behavior of some Scots…The “loyalist element”, with their sad clinging to the Crown and the Union, and fear of being a free people in a free country. But worse, they are fighting to repress the only viable future that Scotland can have. They would, in most countries, not be considered patriotic, or loyal to there own people. The term “Quisling” is an entirely accurate and reasonable term to describe them. To make it precise, I am now going to use the term; “McQuisling”…for that is what they are. They gain pleasure from their hostile resentment against their own people and nation. They would actively support 300 years of colonialism and exploitation to favor themselves. In most countries, they would simply be seen as traitors. They would be despised, ostracized, and excluded from public life. I am astonished at the lack of proper attitude to these people, who in most countries would not dare to show their faces for fear of the legendary Georges Square lamp posts, and the local ” Bolsheviks”. I think the evil spell that these people have cast over Scotland needs to be broken. They need to be seen in the clear night of day..for what they are. They need to be told, in clear terms, what they are, and that what they are doing is treason. To be blunt, after a YES vote, a country that has these people within it and in public life, is fatally undermined. They could never be trusted to put Scotland first. It has to be made clear that there will be a day of reckoning for the “McQuislings”. Where, when we need them, are the “McBolshevik s”?….time for the gloves to come off.

    • Why do you think they daren’t hold properly public meetings, insisting on attendees pre registering and vetting those or simply talking to a room of picked invitees?

      It’s not that they will be decorating the George Sq lampposts other than metaphorically when their pretensions are slit wide open for everyone to see under ‘nasty cybernat’ questions.

      They avoid open meetings for the same reason Cameron is desperately trying to avoid debating with Salmond. They know they cannot survive such things with their reputation and sang froid intact. You may also note the emerging tendency of BT people vetoing the videoing of debates, they don’t want video evidence of them squirming under questioning.

  45. It does seem that the emotional tug that has to be suppressed totally or rationalised into a schizophreniform BritScot identity (the classic McQuisling mental defence mechanism mindsets) leaves them subconsciously immune to rational thought, debate and argument and so easily dismissive of any self-determinant sense of Scottishness. Like a monoglot who shouts very loudly in their native tongue at a foreigner, they think that the sheer volume will make everyone understand…eventually. ‘Scots are not genetically-programmed to’ determine effectively for themselves and ‘are too stupid’ to run things, ‘you can’t do/ won’t have…’ and the ‘country’s too weak’ to cope…just No! No! No! and more No! Never a quiet, reposed ‘no and here’s constructively why’. That’s why many choose to embrace the dangerous beast (to the BritScot McQuislings) of the positive, liberating, self-determined and internationlist prospect offered by Yes! Yes! Yes! A nation of would-be Meg Ryan’s…’I’ll have what she’s having!’

  46. McLean

    I am just telling it as i see it. Bateman has started calling his opponents quislings (someone should cbeck their history) and anti scottish. Posters above and below have applauded that sentiment and some have gone even further calling for mass hangings in George Square. We have another who clearly does have sime weird sexual issues going on. I have taken issue with this ridiculous extremist language and you call me a bully? Absolutely ridiculous.

    You people have spent so long egging each other on and telling each other what you want to hear that you have managed to whip yourselves up into some kind of mass hysteria and your views of reality have become completely distorted. I really dont care whether you agree with me or not as clearly your judgement is flawed.

    on and ps. The last 3 elections i voted SNP. Never again.

    • My, my – “you people” – don’t feel the slightest hysteria. I do not accept that my views are distorted. My judgement is not flawed. You keep missing the point McMad – people who disagree with you may be as normal as anyone else. I give you a wee bit of advice and you carry on calling people names, questioning their mental ability and so on and so on! Why are you such a bullying personality? Study the phenomenon of “bullying” and the “bully” – you may learn a lot about your fears!

  47. It would help if some of the posters on this thread actually read the words that Derek wrote, instead of constructing straw men to knock down. I just ask one thing of these people. Give me the top three positive reasons for remaining in the Union. And please, please keep this civilised.

  48. 1 Ehm …
    2 Ehm …
    3 Ehm … Nothing springing to mind.

  49. “You people…your judgement is flawed”. Oh well, that’s that then.

  50. Earlier in this blog I put a comment on as a response to wind up John McMad, suggesting he came on here to swap abuse in kinky fashion. His reply to my comment http://derekbateman1.wordpress.com/2014/03/13/toom-tabard/comment-page-1/#comment-7359 showed him up to be not a searcher of abuse for masochistic reasons, as in my wind up, but rather as one who wants to invite and collect as much abuse as he can to spread among his own kind in order to denigrate this on-line community. Sick. It was good that Derek seemed to pull the plug on replies to him and cut off the oxygen of abuse he craves for his much more sinister reasons.

    There is a wee lesson there for us all there.

    • Just you keep telling yourself that, the abuse started long before i came on the thread. That is unless you view calling for mass hangings not abusive.

      • MASS hangings?! That’s never been SNP policy. It’s always been gradualist….one at a time. They must be going for economy. There will of course be waiting times but you can nominate a suitable date from your diary. My local branch is offering a memorial photographic service…Get a grip John…who’s losing it now? Derek

        Sent from my iPad

        >

      • Welcome to the internet-Idiot heaven.

  51. Brown is a Sociopath. Alexander is a numpty but also a mercenary as are all Lib Dems.
    Above all the people you mention are in Politics solely for the money. Nothing else matters to them.

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